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Dialogue of civilisations — reality or mirage

Ideas Today

حوار الحضارات — حقيقة أم سراب

The 'Al-Wasatiyya' episode on the dialogue of civilisations. Eighty percent of the studio audience voted that the relation between Muslims and the West today is mostly conflict and 20% dialogue; 1 99% that the West seeks to marginalise and attack Islamic civilisation; 2 49% chose religious institutions to lead the dialogue and 16% intellectual elites; 3 and they split on its aim between proving superiority (46%) and mutual complementarity (50%). 4 The presenter closed by saying the West is not one bloc and that dialogue is necessary, without defeatism. 5

Depth

At a glance

Era
The Contemporary Era
Region
Arab world · Global / Diaspora
Review

Contested: This record includes matters on which scholars differ. The speaker's views are labelled as his, and other views are marked where no cited source yet exists.

Education

Summary

The Al-Wasatiyya programme gave its twenty-third episode to the question: is the dialogue of civilisations a reality or a mirage? Tareq al-Suwaidan introduced it as an intellectual subject debated by thinkers that also has a recurring practical side, citing the Danish cartoons affair, what the Pope said and the uproar that followed, Palestine and Iraq. 6 7 He set out the episode's questions: is today's conflict inevitable or can it be changed, is dialogue of any use, what does each side want from it, and who should represent the umma in it — politicians, scholars or thinkers. 8 9 10

The guests

The guests were the Tunisian journalist Salah al-Din al-Jourshi, whom the presenter introduced as writing in Western as well as Arab papers and in constant contact with the West; 10 11 a historian of Islam and former ambassador introduced as Dr Fayez; 12 13 Ahmad Azm, a political scientist from the Emirates Center for Strategic Studies; 14 the Syrian historian Mahmoud al-Sayyid al-Dughaym, living in Britain; 15 a journalist introduced as Samir; 16 Khaled Hroub, living in London; 17 and Dr Firyal Ali, a specialist in Andalusian literature and civilisation. 18

First poll: conflict or dialogue?

The presenter asked what mostly characterises the relation between Muslims and the West today, not in history: conflict or dialogue. 19 Eighty percent voted conflict and only 20% dialogue. 1

Al-Jourshi said the result did not surprise him: the relation is marked by growing tension rather than outright conflict, for reasons including long colonisation and the Palestinian question, and the tension peaked after 11 September and the invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq and the deepening of discriminatory views of Arabs and Muslims in the West that followed. 20 21 22 He added that dialogue would open and then be halted by political events, and that blaming the West alone for its failure is a mistake. 12

Dr Fayez explained the result by two things: "historical bottlenecks", a past still present in the mind, and today's twin umbrellas of hegemony and globalisation; he said tension rose after September because it was exploited politically, in the media and intellectually. 13 23

Ahmad Azm disagreed: the vote was unsurprising but not necessarily right, since there is no real conflict once political elites are distinguished from peoples and Europe from the United States; he pointed out that opposition to the Iraq war and support for Palestinian rights are stronger in the European street than in the Arab street. 24 25 The presenter replied that when he visited Denmark he thought the problem was only the government, then found that 71% of Danes backed their government; this is his statement. 25 26 Azm said that some practices and statements on the Muslim side, in Australia for instance, had widened the gap, and that Muslims do not manage the conflict well or reach out to the forces close to them in Europe. 26 27 15

Mahmoud al-Dughaym held that there is no dialogue at all, only a continuing and unequal conflict: the West has understood the Muslim world closely for centuries and its research centres work day and night, and parity is a condition of dialogue that is missing. 28 29 30 He said the US defence budget exceeds 300 billion, his figure, that only an uninfluential minority in the West believes in dialogue, cited Ibn Khaldun's saying that the vanquished is fond of imitating the victor, and said he had lived in London for 17 years. 30 31 32 33 The presenter noted that he too had lived 17 years in America. 16

The journalist Samir said dialogue needs parity; civilisations are not books or abstract values but are carried by states ruled by interests and balances of power; in the West politics has swallowed thought, so the cannon decides; and the fine texts of both sides have been lost, to weakness on ours and to interests on theirs. 34 35 36 He criticised what he called the Arabs' wish to be victims. 37

Second poll: does the West seek to marginalise our civilisation?

The presenter asked whether the West seeks to marginalise and attack Islamic civilisation. 38 Ninety-nine percent said yes and only 1% no; he joked that it looked "like Arab election results". 2

Khaled Hroub was among the few: the generalisation that the whole West, from the Pope to the cartoonist, plots to marginalise Muslims is an exaggeration; the West pursues its interests in oil and strategy and seeks neither to marginalise nor to glorify anyone's civilisation. 39 40 He pointed out that most Arab exports go to the West and most Arab students and patients go there, and asked how one could live for years among people bent on fighting one. 41 42 Al-Dughaym replied that the West took what it needed from Islamic civilisation but refuses to give Muslims the exact sciences of the age; this is his claim. 43 44

The presenter, recalling that he had written a book on al-Andalus, asked Dr Firyal Ali whether the history of al-Andalus is repeating itself. She said the clash of civilisations is caused by Western, and especially American, culture seeking hegemony over all peoples; the attack seems aimed at Arabs and Muslims because most Western interests lie in the Middle East; and the most dangerous factor is media power. 18 45 46 47 48

Ahmad Azm said American think tanks did not understand Muslims, otherwise there would have been no quagmire in Iraq, and that many advocates of Islamic civilisation and leaders of Islamic movements are graduates of Western universities. 49 50 51

The two sides' intentions

Dr Fayez said Muslims' starting points are in origin dialogical, da'wa being the root of Islam, but that they present dialogue in an apologetic, self-justifying way that entrenches their weakness, avoiding jihad and zakat for fear of accusation; the content is fixed while the method develops. 52 53 54 55

Al-Jourshi called some interventions "nihilistic", resting on self-exoneration, and said Muslims bear responsibility for much of the negative course of events: had they had real governments, civil societies, democracy, education and knowledge of their surroundings, they would not have lost Palestine in this way. 56 57 58 59 The presenter objected that Britain handed Palestine over and America was the first to recognise Israel. 60 Al-Jourshi added that Muslims need dialogue most; that the misdeeds of some members of Muslim communities explain part of the Western backlash; that Muslim communities are growing in Europe and America, where Islam has become a legal and constitutional reality; that the West has many levels and parties; and that Muslims do not know it. 61 62 63 64 The presenter summed up his view as worth thinking about. 65

Third poll: who should lead the dialogue?

The presenter offered three choices: governments, since decision and power are theirs; intellectual elites; or religious institutions, for those who see the conflict as religious at its core. 66 67 68 69 Thirty-five percent chose governments, 16% intellectual elites and 49% religious institutions. 70 3 The presenter said he was surprised: governments are what brought the umma to its present state, and choosing scholars suggests, in his reading, that the audience sees the conflict as a new crusade. 71 72

Al-Jourshi held that Islamic religious institutions are the least able to lead the dialogue, since their educational systems have not undergone basic review and they are unaware of what happens in the West; he asked scholars to master modern methods and know the West, and mentioned the thinker Hasan Hanafi's call for an "Occidentalism" as the counterpart of Orientalism. 73 74 75 He called for a broad civilisational alliance with Japan, China, India, Latin America and Africa instead of reducing the question to the West. 76

Dr Fayez distinguished interfaith dialogue, where scholars of the sharia lead, from the dialogue of civilisations; many scholars are intellectuals and many intellectuals are scholars; a scholar who withdraws from the world is unsuited to this; and the watchword of dialogue is mutual acquaintance. 77 78 79 80

Al-Dughaym said the campaigns against the hijab in France and elsewhere show that the core of the conflict is religious, while insisting that he favours dialogue and that Islam is a religion of dialogue and da'wa with no compulsion. 81 82 83 84

The journalist Samir objected to the question itself: the relation with the West is an interlocking system of economics, politics and diaspora communities, not a table with two sides; each issue has those best fitted to it; and among the drivers of Western policy he named arms makers, oil men, the Zionist lobby and the neoconservatives. 84 85 86 87 88 The presenter announced that the programme would give special episodes to conspiracy theory and to the hijab. 87

Dr Firyal said she believes successful cultural dialogue is possible, as the Andalusian experience shows, and that political elites in East and West should give intellectuals the green light for a workable cultural strategy. 89 90 91 From the audience, one man said dialogue had run its course and a phase of conflict had begun, while a young woman said dialogue accompanies every stage of civilisation, even in weakness. 92 93

The presenter commented that the umma's scholars carry an extraordinary responsibility, since the young are still attached to them; in his view the umma wants religious scholars who understand politics, civilisation, thought and the West and who lead its youth, and a scholar who studies only the sharia sciences is not qualified for this. 94 95 96

Fourth poll: what is dialogue for?

The presenter offered two aims: "proving our superiority", by showing the solutions Islam offers humanity, or "complementarity of the two sides", acknowledging where the West is ahead and exchanging benefits. 97 98 99 100 Forty-six percent chose superiority and 50% complementarity; the presenter said he was glad the larger share favoured learning from others, since entering with a spirit of superiority could make the dialogue fail. 101 4 102

Al-Jourshi listed four aims: knowing the other; introducing ourselves and defending our interests; building bridges of trust and alliances with Western civil society; and using dialogue to rebuild an Arab-Islamic culture open to the age — on condition that it goes with internal reform, since those who fail at dialogue with those who differ at home cannot succeed abroad. 102 103 104 105

Khaled Hroub said he voted for complementarity as the only thing that can work, and that the West does better in management and science; the discussion grew heated with a guest in the audience until the presenter asked for an apology for the interruption, restored order and the apology was given. 106 107 108 109 The journalist Samir said the problem was one of method: whoever dislikes an opinion files it under accusation. 110 Dr Fayez said anyone who enters dialogue with a defeated mentality should be kept out of it, and that the one who speaks must want to strengthen the umma and claim its rights. 111 112

The presenter's conclusion

The presenter said the umma is proud and will not accept defeat before hegemony or conflict, and that in a time of weakness dialogue reduces the distortion and helps divide the West into its real kinds: religious and political enemies, the confused, those who know Muslims only from films, and fair-minded thinkers. 113 5 Treating the whole West as one party is an error of analysis that leads to an error of action, he said, and lessening an enemy's hostility by even one percent is a gain. 114 He said the umma tried for seven hundred years to conquer the West by arms and could not, while South-East Asia was opened without arms, through conduct; this is his statement. 114 115 He called for a return to the root of the religion in da'wa and dialogue without defeatism, starting with reform at home and restoring freedom to the peoples, with scholars leading the dialogue and politicians supporting it. 115 116

The vote results here are the opinions of that episode's studio audience, not representative surveys.

Opinions on the question

The question: Is the relation between Muslims and the West today one of conflict or of dialogue, who should conduct the dialogue, and to what end?

First opinion · Sunni tradition (the museum's frame) · Sunni frame (speaker's opinion): the presenter Tareq al-SuwaidanMain reference

dialogue is rooted in da'wa and necessary without defeatism; the West is of many kinds; reform begins at home 5.
More opinions (4)

Guest view: self-critique first (Salah al-Din al-Jourshi) viewOther opinion

we are the weaker side and bear much of the blame 58.

Guest view: conflict, not dialogue (Mahmoud al-Sayyid al-Dughaym) viewOther opinion

an unequal conflict whose core is religious 28.

Guest view: interests, not marginalisation (Khaled Hroub, Ahmad Azm) viewOther opinion

the West pursues its interests, and peoples differ from elites 40.

Academic view (not yet sourced) viewSecondary opinion

academic studies of the dialogue of civilisations have not yet been added to this entry.

Connections

Explore the connections

Subject of
Al-Wasatiyya (panel programme)

People and things also explored

The 'new preachers' — between renewal and innovation· Art between commitment and freedom· Women and political work· Reading and culture (al-qira'a wa-l-thaqafa)· Education between westernisation and preserving identity· Prophetic medicine and alternative medicine — what it is and its limits· The youth cultural crisis· Graduates of the sharia colleges and the challenges of the present

Sources

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  93. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:55:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  94. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:57:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  95. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:58:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  96. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:58:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  97. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:59:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  98. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 00:59:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  99. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:00:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  100. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:00:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  101. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:02:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  102. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:03:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  103. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:04:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  104. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:04:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  105. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:05:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  106. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:05:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  107. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:06:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  108. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:07:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  109. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:08:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  110. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:10:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  111. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:11:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  112. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:12:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  113. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:13:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  114. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:14:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  115. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:15:00 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
  116. Assabile archive of Tareq al-Suwaidan's lectures (video) , Al Wassitiya, episode 23, at 01:15:30 · Listen at the archive (opens the audio at this time)
Cite this page

islam.museum contributors. “Dialogue of civilisations — reality or mirage”. islam.museum, https://islam.museum/en/concept/hiwar-al-hadarat/. CC BY-SA 4.0. Last updated 2026-11-01.

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The 'Al-Wasatiyya' episode on 'the new preachers between renewal and innovation', a term the presenter says the media coined. The studio audience was asked whether it had clear criteria to tell new preachers from others: 21% said clear and precise criteria, 60% general but imprecise ones, and 19% did not accept the label at all. The archive recording breaks off after about seven minutes.